9-3-46 Morning

Dr. Masalavala, retired Chief Medical Officer of Bhopal,
who has been here for more than a month now and who is now also in temporary charge of the Asramam Hospital in the absence of Dr. Shiva Rao, put the following questions to Bhagavan and got the following answers:

Question: Bhagavan says, `The influence of the jnani
steals into the devotee in silence.' Bhagavan also says, `Contact with great men, exalted souls, is one efficacious means of realising one's true being.'

Bhagavan: Yes. What is the contradiction? Jnani, great
men, exalted souls — does he (Dr.) differentiate between these?

Thereupon I said, `No'.

Bhagavan: Contact with them is good. They will work
through silence. By speaking, their power is reduced. Silence is most powerful. Speech is always less powerful than silence. So mental contact is the best.

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Question: Does this hold good even after the dissolution
of the physical body of the jnani or is it true only so long as he is in flesh and blood?

Bhagavan: Guru is not the physical form. So the contact
will remain even after the physical form of the Guru vanishes.

Question: Similarly, does the contact of a devotee with
his Guru continue after the passing of the Guru or does it stop? It is possible that for a ripe soul his Self may act as his Guru after the going away of the Guru, but what is the unripe soul to do? Bhagavan has said that an outer Guru is also needed to push the mind of the devotee towards the Self. Can he come in contact with another adept? Is this contact to be necessarily physical or will a mental contact do? Which is better?

Bhagavan: As already explained, Guru not being physical
form, his contact will continue after his form vanishes. If one jnani exists in the world, his influence will be felt by or benefit all people in the world and not simply his immediate disciples. All the people in the world are divided into his disciples, bhaktas, those who are indifferent to him and those who are even hostile to him and it is said in the following verse that all these classes will be benefited by the existence of the jnani.

From Vedanta Chudamani:

?S?U?? ?P?W?? TjR?R??]o ?~?p T??

L?[u? S?pY?L ?V??Pj? ??\?]?d?WLm Yk?? U?s?L?s ?Yu?jR? ?XuTYW?Y??\ ??]?j ??WlT?m. Bhagavan quoted the next verse, viz., ?R?Y?V ?Yu?dRuR{ Sm?U R?t ?Pod? ?j?? Uu?T?? Y?T?PR{l ׬? ?VoTjRod? Sp?{? UYu\u ײR?? N?RU? LiP ?R??]odϬV ?i?V -?l? UYu\u Y??{d Li??Ru ?RX?]Yt?p T??Lh? T?Y ??? ???UuTo. The gist is: `Four classes of people are benefited by jivanmuktas. By his faith in the jivanmukta ^[?], the disciple attains mukti ^[?], the
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bhakta who worships his Guru attains merit, the indifferent who have seen the sacred life of the jivanmukta ^[?] acquire desire for righteousness and even the sinners (i.e., the hostile in the first verse) get rid of their sins by the mere fact of their having had darshan ^[?] of such saints.' God, Guru and the Self are the same. After your bhakti ^[?] to God has matured you, God comes in the shape of Guru and from outside pushes your mind inside, while being inside as Self he draws you there from within. Such a Guru is needed generally, though not for very rare and advanced souls. One can go to another Guru after his Guru passes away. But all Gurus are one, as none of them is the form. Always mental contact is the best.

Question: My practice has been a continuous japa ^[?] of
the names of God with the incoming breath and the name of Baba (i.e., Upasani Baba or Sai Baba) with the outgoing breath. Simultaneously with this I see the form of Baba always. Even in Bhagavan, I see Baba. The external appearances are also much alike. Bhagavan is thin. Baba was a little stout. Now, should I continue this or change the method, as something from within says that if I stick to the name and form I shall never go above name and form? But I can't understand what further to do after giving up name and form. Will Bhagavan please enlighten me on the point?

Bhagavan: You may continue in your present method.

When the japa ^[?] becomes continuous, all other thoughts cease and one is in one's real nature, which is japa ^[?] or dhyana ^[?]. We turn our mind outwards on things of the world and are therefore not aware of our real nature being always japa ^[?]. When by conscious effort or japa ^[?] or dhyana ^[?] as we call it, we prevent our mind from thinking of other things, then what remains is our real nature, which is japa ^[?].

So long as you think you are name and form, you can't
escape name and form in japa ^[?] also. When you realise you are
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not name and form, then name and form will drop off themselves. No other effort is necessary. Japa or dhyana ^[?] will naturally and as a matter of course lead to it. What is now regarded as the means, japa ^[?], will then be found to be the goal. Name and God are not different. See the teaching of Nama Dev on the significance of God's name, extracted in the September, 1937, issue of the Vision. (This was read out in the hall).

Bhagavan also quoted the Bible, `In the beginning was
the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.'

Question: Is liberation to be achieved before the
dissolution of the body or can it be had after death? What is the meaning of a verse like II, 72 or VIII, 6 of the Gita?

Bhagavan: Is there death for you? For whom is death?

The body which dies, were you aware of it, did you have it, during sleep? The body was not, when you slept, but you existed even then. When you awoke, you got the body and even in the waking state you exist. You existed both in sleep and waking. But the body did not exist in sleep and exists only in waking. That which does not exist always, but exists at one time and not at another, cannot be real. You exist always and you alone are therefore real.

Liberation is another name for you. It is always here and
now with you. It has not to be won or reached hereafter or somewhere. Christ has said, "The Kingdom of God is within you" here and now. You have no death. Thayumanavar has sung, `NkRR?m ?YR?U??—_L Á§?kR??m UWQ?i ?PuT? NR??xPo ?{Y?p~' (i.e., even when living in the world those who are always in nishta do not think there is such a thing as death).

The Gita verse only means in the context of the whole
Gita (Ch. II, for instance) that you must achieve liberation during your lifetime. Even if you fail to do it during your lifetime, you must think of God at least at the time of death, since one becomes
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what he thinks of at the time of death. But unless all your life you have been thinking of God, unless you have accustomed yourself to dhyana ^[?] of God always during life, it would not at all be possible for you to think of God at the time of death.