16th December, 1936

Talk 295.

Mr. Natverlal Parekh, a Gujerati gentleman who had attended the International Religious Conference as a delegate from Baroda, came here on a visit. He is a young man, well-groomed, alert, and quite conscious of his well-earned merit. He presented a note containing some questions to Sri Bhagavan.
D.: Pray help me realise Atma - Paramatma - Satchidananda.
M.: Atma - Paramatma - Satchidananda mean one and the same thing , i.e., the Self. The Self is eternally realised. Otherwise there will be no pleasure in it. If it is not eternal it must have a beginning; what begins will also end; so that it is only transient. There is no use seeking for a temporary state of affairs. The fact is that it is the state of effortless, ever alert Peace. Effortlessness while remaining aware is the state of Bliss, and that is Realisation.

D.: I do not want intellectual answers. I want them to be practical.
M.: Yes. Direct knowledge does not require intellectual discourses.

Since the Self is directly experienced by everyone, they are not at all necessary. Everyone says "I am". Is there anything more to realise?

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D.: It is not clear to me.
M.: You exist. You say `I am'. That means existence.
D.: But I am not sure of it, i.e., my existence.
M.: Oh! Who then is speaking now?
D.: I, surely. But whether I exist or not, I am not sure. Moreover , admitting my existence leads me nowhere.

M.: There must be one even to deny the existence. If you do not exist , there is no questioner, and no question can arise.

D.: Let us take it that I exist.
M.: How do you know that you exist?
D.: Because I think, I feel, I see, etc.
M.: So you mean that your existence is inferred from these.

Furthermore, there is no feeling, thinking etc., in sleep and yet there is the being.

D.: But no. I cannot say that I was in deep sleep.
M.: Do you deny your existence in sleep?
D.: I may be or may not be in sleep. God knows.
M.: When you wake up from sleep, you remember what you did before falling asleep.

D.: I can say that I was before and after sleep, but I cannot say if I

was in sleep.

M.: Do you now say that you were asleep?
D.: Yes.
M.: How do you know unless you remember the state of sleep?
D.: It does not follow that I existed in sleep. Admission of such existence leads nowhere.

M.: Do you mean to say that a man dies every time that sleep overtakes him and that he resuscitates while waking?

D.: Maybe. God alone knows.
M.: Then let God come and find the solution for these riddles. If one were to die in sleep, one will be afraid of sleep, just as one fears death. On the other hand one courts sleep. Why should sleep be courted unless there is pleasure in it?

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D.: There is no positive pleasure in sleep. Sleep is courted only to be rid of physical fatigue.

M.: Well, that is right. "To be free from fatigue." There is one who is free from fatigue.

D.: Yes.
M.: So you are in sleep and you are now too. You were happy in sleep without feeling, thinking etc. The same one continuing now, why are you not happy?

D.: How can it be said that there is happiness?
M.: Everyone says Sukhamahamasvapsam (I slept happily or was blissfully asleep).

D.: I do not think that they are right. There is no sukha ^[?] (bliss). It is only absence of sorrow.

M.: Your very being is bliss. Therefore everyone says I was blissfully asleep. That means that one remains in the primal uncontaminated state in sleep. As for sorrow, there is no sorrow. Where is it in order that you might speak of its absence in sleep? The present wrong identification of the Self with the body has given rise to all mistakes.

D.: What I want is realisation. I do not feel my inherent happy nature.
M.: Because the Self is now identified with the non-self. The non-self too is not apart from the Self. However, there is the wrong notion that the body is apart and the Self is confounded with the body. This wrong identity must be ended for happiness to manifest.

D.: I am unable to help myself. The Engineer suggested surrender to the Master.
D.: Agreed.
M.: Your nature is happiness. You say that is not apparent. See what obstructs you from your true being. It is pointed out to you that the obstruction is the wrong identity. Eliminate the error. The patient must himself take the medicine prescribed by the doctor in order that he may be cured of his illness.

D.: The patient is too weak to help himself and places himself unconditionally in the hands of the doctor.

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M.: The doctor must be given a free hand and the patient must only remain quiet without saying anything. Similarly keep quiet. That is effortlessness.

D.: That is the most effective medicine too. The other questions which he wrote down were:
D.: Convince me of the existence of God.
M.: Realisation of the Self amounts to such conviction.
D.: How is prarabdha ^[?] (past karma) related to purushakara ^[?] (one' s own effort here)?

M.: Prarabdha ^[?] is karma (action). There must be a karta ^[?] (doer) for it.

See who the karta is. Purushakara ^[?] is effort. See who exerts. There is identity established. The one who seeks to know their relation is himself the link.

D.: What is karma and rebirth?
M.: See the karta (doer) and then the karma (action) becomes obvious.

If you are born now, rebirth may follow. See if you are born now.

D.: Help me to have jyotidarsana (vision of light).
M.: Darsana (sight) implies drashta ^[?] (seer). Find him and darsana

(sight) is included in him.